Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo

Jun 3, '17, 8:35 pm

Dwyer Regular Member   Join Date: February 26, 2007 Posts: 1,361 Religion: Byzantine Catholic

Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo Quote: WASHINGTON - A federal district court judge has overturned the sentence of Lee Boyd Malvo, one of the two people convicted in D.C.-area Beltway sniper attacks nearly 15 years ago, according to a ruling released Friday. Malvo was sentenced to life in prison without parole for the sniper-style attacks committed around the region in October 2002 along with John Allen Muhammad. Ten people were killed and three others were shot during a three-week period. Malvo appealed to the court saying he should not have been sentenced to life without parole because he was 17 years old at the time of the murders and he based his appeal on the Supreme Court ruling in Miller v. Alabama. http://www.fox5dc.com/news/local-news/257218742-story In the U.S., you cannot be locked up for life in prison for shooting and helping to kill 10 people until you reach the magic age of 18. BTW, I saw no coverage about this on the Cable News Networks because it isn't about President Trump. __________________ "It's a free country; you can say whatever you want." --Old American Saying (U.S. Postal Service stamp-- from 1977 Americana series which extols freedom of speech and features a Speaker's Stand decorated with an American Flag shield.)

#2   Jun 3, '17, 8:39 pm

Seamus L Senior Member   Join Date: November 22, 2007 Posts: 8,099 Religion: Catholic

Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo We were lied to about this case. The Beltway Snipers were Islamic terrorists.

#3   Jun 3, '17, 8:45 pm

Sy Noe Senior Member   Join Date: October 7, 2013 Posts: 8,033 Religion: Non practicing Roman Catholic with mainline Christian faith

Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo Quote: Originally Posted by Dwyer http://www.fox5dc.com/news/local-news/257218742-story In the U.S., you cannot be locked up for life in prison for shooting and helping to kill 10 people until you reach the magic age of 18. BTW, I saw no coverage about this on the Cable News Networks because it isn't about President Trump. Apparently Pope Francis would agree with the judge. He called for abolition of the death penalty as well as life imprisonment, and denounced what he called a "penal populism" that promises to solve society's problems by punishing crime instead of pursuing social justice. "All Christians and people of good will are thus called today to struggle not only for abolition of the death penalty, whether it be legal or illegal and in all its forms, but also to improve prison conditions, out of respect for the human dignity of persons deprived of their liberty. And this, I connect with life imprisonment," he said. "Life imprisonment is a hidden death penalty." The pope said criminal penalties should not apply to children, and should be waived or limited for the elderly, who "on the basis of their very errors can offer lessons to the rest of society. We don't learn only from the virtues of saints but also from the failings and errors of sinners." https://www.ncronline.org/blogs/fran...e-imprisonment __________________ "We cannot insist only on issues related to abortion, gay marriage... it is not necessary to talk about these issues all the time." "The view of the church’s teaching as a monolith to defend without nuance or different understandings is wrong." (Pope Francis)

#4   Jun 3, '17, 10:40 pm

Dwyer Regular Member   Join Date: February 26, 2007 Posts: 1,361 Religion: Byzantine Catholic

Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo Quote: Originally Posted by Sy Noe Apparently Pope Francis would agree with the judge. He called for abolition of the death penalty as well as life imprisonment, and denounced what he called a "penal populism" that promises to solve society's problems by punishing crime instead of pursuing social justice. "All Christians and people of good will are thus called today to struggle not only for abolition of the death penalty, whether it be legal or illegal and in all its forms, but also to improve prison conditions, out of respect for the human dignity of persons deprived of their liberty. And this, I connect with life imprisonment," he said. "Life imprisonment is a hidden death penalty." The pope said criminal penalties should not apply to children, and should be waived or limited for the elderly, who "on the basis of their very errors can offer lessons to the rest of society. We don't learn only from the virtues of saints but also from the failings and errors of sinners." https://www.ncronline.org/blogs/fran...e-imprisonment Thanks for sharing the Pope's statements. Pope Francis made those remarks during a speech to the International Association of Penal Law. I appreciate the Holy Father's words on the matter. And I could see under some extenuating circumstances and situations that a life sentence should not be imposed on a criminal. And, as Catholics, we must personally forgive those who have trespassed against us. Given the age that this particular criminal committed his crimes (age 17), the multiple number of murders and attempted murders committed, the 10 human beings slain in cold blood, and the fundamental need to protect the safety of all citizens, I would have to respectfully disagree if the Pope's ideas on penal law were applied to the particular case of Mr. Lee Boyd Malvo. There may be a legitimate diversity of opinion among reasonable Catholics on this particular criminal case. __________________ "It's a free country; you can say whatever you want." --Old American Saying (U.S. Postal Service stamp-- from 1977 Americana series which extols freedom of speech and features a Speaker's Stand decorated with an American Flag shield.)

#5   Jun 3, '17, 11:35 pm

GEddie Forum Elder Book Club Member   Join Date: March 18, 2009 Posts: 89,370 Religion: Catholic

Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo I don't understand why someone should be exempted from legal punishment, whether it be execution or a long prison term, just for being young. The young are just as capable of being knowingly cruel as anybody else. Ask anybody who has been to high school. Remember the Fatima children's (now Fatima saints' ?) dead friend Amelia. To have been the friend of young children, she could have been no more than an adolescent at death. Yet the apparition told them, she'd be in Purgatory until the end of time. Clearly youth is not an excuse for all actions. If you can't do the time don't do the crime. ICXC NIKA

#6   Jun 4, '17, 7:09 am

mikekle Veteran Member   Join Date: August 3, 2012 Posts: 10,491 Religion: raised catholic

Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo Quote: Originally Posted by GEddie I don't understand why someone should be exempted from legal punishment, whether it be execution or a long prison term, just for being young. The young are just as capable of being knowingly cruel as anybody else. Ask anybody who has been to high school. Remember the Fatima children's (now Fatima saints' ?) dead friend Amelia. To have been the friend of young children, she could have been no more than an adolescent at death. Yet the apparition told them, she'd be in Purgatory until the end of time. Clearly youth is not an excuse for all actions. If you can't do the time don't do the crime. ICXC NIKA I liked this part of it...and denounced what he called a "penal populism" that promises to solve society's problems by punishing crime instead of pursuing social justice. But it seems we are going in the opposite direction, Just the other day I saw a news article about a local teacher being caught having sex with a 17 yr old student, there were 100s of comments, every single one of them was negative, and most suggested some terrible method this teacher should be executed with. This is just one example, but its very clear to me society is going back to medieval mindset when it comes to crime and punishment, people today want blood, they want people locked up for life. I would like to look back and see how we got to this point again, its a very strange time in history when so many people seem to be on the side of the law/authority, instead of their fellow citizen, I think this may have been done on purpose for some sneaky reason too.

#7   Jun 4, '17, 7:30 am

Michael68 Banned   Join Date: August 17, 2015 Posts: 5,225 Religion: Cradle Roman Catholic

Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo Quote: Originally Posted by Sy Noe Apparently Pope Francis would agree with the judge. He called for abolition of the death penalty as well as life imprisonment, and denounced what he called a "penal populism" that promises to solve society's problems by punishing crime instead of pursuing social justice. "All Christians and people of good will are thus called today to struggle not only for abolition of the death penalty, whether it be legal or illegal and in all its forms, but also to improve prison conditions, out of respect for the human dignity of persons deprived of their liberty. And this, I connect with life imprisonment," he said. "Life imprisonment is a hidden death penalty." The pope said criminal penalties should not apply to children, and should be waived or limited for the elderly, who "on the basis of their very errors can offer lessons to the rest of society. We don't learn only from the virtues of saints but also from the failings and errors of sinners." https://www.ncronline.org/blogs/fran...e-imprisonment I do not believe in the death penalty, but I do believe certain individuals need to be taken out of society

#8   Jun 4, '17, 8:00 am

jediliz Regular Member   Join Date: March 20, 2005 Posts: 4,541 Religion: Catholic and Proud of it!

Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo Judge is a Clinton appointee...no surprise there. Youth is not an excuse for murder. How many school shooters were under 18? (And how many never arrested because they killed themselves)? __________________ A Rosary a Day Keeps the Devil Away! "More souls go to hell because of sins of the flesh than for any other reason." - Our Lady of Fatima Who will speak for those who have no voice? Life.....what a beautiful choice!

#9   Jun 4, '17, 8:02 am

Tim_D Regular Member   Join Date: July 1, 2015 Posts: 2,902 Religion: Catholic

Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo So, if you can't lock him up for the rest of his life because of his age, how long should a 17 year old get for murdering 10 people? Think of this, too; had he been just a few months older, this wouldn't even be an issue. What is the difference between one person who is 18 years old to the day but another who is 17 years, 10 months and 4 days? Remember, these murders weren't committed in the heat of criminal activity. They were committed with reflection, thought and purpose for no reason other than to kill innocent people. Justice demands that someone like this pay for his crimes with his life.

#10   Jun 4, '17, 8:30 am

QuestLove Regular Member   Join Date: July 16, 2014 Posts: 636 Religion: Christian

Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo It actually made the news here in Jamaica especially in the parish where he was born and grew up. The emotions are mixed here, some believe he got off too lightly and of course some think there are mitigating factors. I don't necessarily think that the American media has forgotten what has happened, I just think so many things are happening on the world stage it pushes the story out of the limelight. Especially with what happened in London yesterday, this story has been relegated to the back page. It is a huge story where I live because the community is small and everyone knows everyone.

#11   Jun 4, '17, 9:28 am

Sy Noe Senior Member   Join Date: October 7, 2013 Posts: 8,033 Religion: Non practicing Roman Catholic with mainline Christian faith

Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo Quote: Originally Posted by Dwyer Thanks for sharing the Pope's statements. Pope Francis made those remarks during a speech to the International Association of Penal Law. I appreciate the Holy Father's words on the matter. And I could see under some extenuating circumstances and situations that a life sentence should not be imposed on a criminal. And, as Catholics, we must personally forgive those who have trespassed against us. Given the age that this particular criminal committed his crimes (age 17), the multiple number of murders and attempted murders committed, the 10 human beings slain in cold blood, and the fundamental need to protect the safety of all citizens, I would have to respectfully disagree if the Pope's ideas on penal law were applied to the particular case of Mr. Lee Boyd Malvo. There may be a legitimate diversity of opinion among reasonable Catholics on this particular criminal case. You are more than welcome. I will just note further that in his address to the US Congress, Francis also said, "I also offer encouragement to all those who are convinced that a just and necessary punishment must never exclude the dimension of hope and the goal of rehabilitation". https://www.washingtonpost.com/local...=.583ba7777c55 Which makes me wonder if at least part of the reason the Catholic faithful's Vicar of Christ questions the need for life imprisonment without parole is a matter of mercy and forgiveness and the possibility of rehabilitation and a return to being a productive member of society. But yes I know the faithful must agree with the Catholic Church's earthly leader on teaching faith and morals when he speaks on things such as abortion and SSM. But not moral matters that are for instance related to such matters as the death penalty, life imprisonment, health care, the excesses of capitalism, climate change, immigration. __________________ "We cannot insist only on issues related to abortion, gay marriage... it is not necessary to talk about these issues all the time." "The view of the church’s teaching as a monolith to defend without nuance or different understandings is wrong." (Pope Francis)

#12   Jun 4, '17, 9:36 am

Sy Noe Senior Member   Join Date: October 7, 2013 Posts: 8,033 Religion: Non practicing Roman Catholic with mainline Christian faith

Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo Quote: Originally Posted by Michael68 I do not believe in the death penalty, but I do believe certain individuals need to be taken out of society Hi Michael, I have a tendency to agree with you. As I have always opposed the death penalty on the basis that juries can be wrong and the state should not be playing God and 2 wrongs do not make a right. But over the years I have favored life without parole. Francis's words on life imprisonment and rehabilitation nevertheless struck a chord with me and at the very least gave me something to ponder. __________________ "We cannot insist only on issues related to abortion, gay marriage... it is not necessary to talk about these issues all the time." "The view of the church’s teaching as a monolith to defend without nuance or different understandings is wrong." (Pope Francis)

#13   Jun 4, '17, 9:48 am

Tim_D Regular Member   Join Date: July 1, 2015 Posts: 2,902 Religion: Catholic

Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo Quote: Originally Posted by Sy Noe As I have always opposed the death penalty on the basis that juries can be wrong and the state should not be playing God and 2 wrongs do not make a right. If juries can be wrong and "2 wrongs do not make a right," then how can you support the Justice system at all? If it is unacceptable to execute an innocent person then it should also be unacceptable to incarcerate for any length of time a person who may also be innocent.

#14   Jun 4, '17, 9:58 am

Michael68 Banned   Join Date: August 17, 2015 Posts: 5,225 Religion: Cradle Roman Catholic

Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo Quote: Originally Posted by Sy Noe Hi Michael, I have a tendency to agree with you. As I have always opposed the death penalty on the basis that juries can be wrong and the state should not be playing God and 2 wrongs do not make a right. But over the years I have favored life without parole. Francis's words on life imprisonment and rehabilitation nevertheless struck a chord with me and at the very least gave me something to ponder. I can agree. I do believe some individuals cannot be rehabilitated. Take serial killers for example. They will only kill again. They need to be out of society

#15   Jun 4, '17, 10:49 am

Sy Noe Senior Member   Join Date: October 7, 2013 Posts: 8,033 Religion: Non practicing Roman Catholic with mainline Christian faith

Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo Quote: Originally Posted by Tim_D If juries can be wrong and "2 wrongs do not make a right," then how can you support the Justice system at all? If it is unacceptable to execute an innocent person then it should also be unacceptable to incarcerate for any length of time a person who may also be innocent. Have you never heard of an innocent person being released from prison? If the state kills them, it is too late. At least if they were wrongly incarcerated, they can still be freed. __________________ "We cannot insist only on issues related to abortion, gay marriage... it is not necessary to talk about these issues all the time." "The view of the church’s teaching as a monolith to defend without nuance or different understandings is wrong." (Pope Francis)      Jun 4, '17, 11:09 am Tim_D Regular Member   Join Date: July 1, 2015 Posts: 2,902 Religion: Catholic Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo Quote: Originally Posted by Sy Noe Have you never heard of an innocent person being released from prison? If the state kills them, it is too late. At least if they were wrongly incarcerated, they can still be freed. I think I would rather be killed than spend 30 years in prison for a crime I did not commit.   #17   Jun 4, '17, 1:31 pm St Pancake Regular Member   Join Date: March 3, 2015 Posts: 975 Religion: Catholic Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo Quote: Originally Posted by Michael68 I do not believe in the death penalty, but I do believe certain individuals need to be taken out of society I can assure you the death penalty does exist and if you would like, I can prove that to you. Now, like me, you might not think the death penalty a good idea but it does exist.   #18   Jun 4, '17, 1:39 pm Michael68 Banned   Join Date: August 17, 2015 Posts: 5,225 Religion: Cradle Roman Catholic Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo Quote: Originally Posted by St Pancake I can assure you the death penalty does exist and if you would like, I can prove that to you. Now, like me, you might not think the death penalty a good idea but it does exist. Poor choice of words. I know it exists.   #19   Jun 4, '17, 1:42 pm dvdjs Senior Member   Join Date: August 13, 2007 Posts: 6,874 Religion: Byzantine Catholic Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo Quote: Originally Posted by Michael68 Poor choice of words. I know it exists. Ha. It reminds of the the old joke about a member of a certain sect that only allowed adults to be baptized. When asked if he believed in infant baptism, he replied: Not only do I believe in it, I've even seen it done!   #20   Jun 4, '17, 1:43 pm St Pancake Regular Member   Join Date: March 3, 2015 Posts: 975 Religion: Catholic Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo Quote: Originally Posted by Michael68 Poor choice of words. I know it exists. Please don't take it personally, I'm just kidding around.   #21   Jun 4, '17, 1:56 pm GEddie Forum Elder Book Club Member   Join Date: March 18, 2009 Posts: 89,370 Religion: Catholic Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo This is not a topic that lends easily to kidding. ICXC NIKA   #22   Jun 4, '17, 1:58 pm St Pancake Regular Member   Join Date: March 3, 2015 Posts: 975 Religion: Catholic Re: Judge overturns life without parole sentence for DC sniper Lee Boyd Malvo Quote: Originally Posted by GEddie This is not a topic that lends easily to kidding. ICXC NIKA Phew, thank goodness I wasn't kidding about the topic.